5th Generation?

[SofaRider]

I'm starting to get the new-car bug... Anyone have a definite answer as to when the next generation 4Runners will be out? I've heard late '08 as an '09 and late '09 as a '10, but nothing for sure. I figure if anyone knew, someone on here would.

[bulldog]

I dunno, but it seems 09 model year will most likely be when they updte the 4RUnner. Given that they now updated the Sequia, Highlander, Rav4 and Land Cruiser recently. Teh only truck in the SUV line up left is the 4RUnner. Given the dwindling sales it might be a good time.

SOme folks predicted 10 model year though, given the fact that we haven't seen anything yet.

[AlexJet]

As far as I know it should come out as '09.
The only thing is that there is an information (unconfirmed) that it will have independant rear as Highlander, so good-buy solid axle. Toyota states that they have off-road vehicle: FJ, now they just need upper-midsize SUV (RAV4 is small, Highlander - lower-midsize, 4Runner - upper-midsize, Sequoia and Land Cruiser - big).
I think more detail information will be Spring/Summer.

[brad d]

I think it will be less of a truck and more of a SUV... unibody... IRS... most people ore going over to smaller SUV's.

http://money.cnn.com/2007/12/17/mag...sion=2007121815

NEW YORK (Fortune) -- Never easy, the automobile business has gotten exponentially more difficult in recent months, as manufacturers rewrite their new model plans to cope with the eventual tightening of fuel economy standards.

The latest victim is Volvo. According to a report in a Swedish auto magazine, Volvo is performing euthanasia on its popular sport-utility, the XC90. A revamped XC90 that was due to hit the market in 2010 has been cancelled because Volvo had no hybrid powertrain to put in it. For a brand that aspires to greenness as Volvo does, such an absence could be highly damaging to its environmental image. So after a facelift that will keep it on the market until 2012, the popular and highly-profitable XC90 will go wheels-up.

Although Volvo denied any plans to kill the XC90, it wouldn't be the first SUV headed off to the automotive graveyard. According to intelligence work by Global Insight, the Waltham, Massachusetts research and consulting firm, General Motors (GM, Fortune 500) has decided not to replace the old Chevy TrailBlazer and GMC Envoy when they expire in 2010. And Lexus has designated no successor to the FX 470 when it goes away at the end of the 2009 model year.

"They have to do it," says senior analyst John Wolkonowicz. "It is what consumers want."

Other manufacturers area are moving old SUV nameplates over to new-style SUVs, known as crossovers, that weigh less, deliver better fuel-economy, and are less in-your-face than the old trucky ones.

Both consumers and automakers will wind up paying for the changeover. Switching from old-style SUVs is expensive for automakers, who have to scrap their profitable truck engineering for more cost-constrained car mechanicals. That additional cost is likely to be passed along to consumers - along with all the other expenses of meeting the new fuel-economy requirements that could stretch as high as $5,000 a vehicle.

It is an ignoble end to a proud motoring era. Not more than 15 years ago, SUVs ruled the automotive landscape and produced record profits during Detroit's last golden age. Now the most popular SUV of that era, the Ford Explorer, is headed to the scrap heap, done in by fuel economy and the lingering effects of tire-shredding and rollover issues from several years ago.

The Explorer has been a shadow of its former self, selling at less than half of the 400,000 units a year it did during its glory years. The name will continue on but the vehicle is moving on the passenger car platform used by the Ford Taurus around 2011. (Those interested in a sneak preview can see Ford's (F, Fortune 500) concept-car version of the new Explorer at the 2008 Detroit auto show in January.) Likewise, the Chrysler Aspen and Dodge Durango, latecomers to the SUV party, will shift onto the unibody platform used by the Jeep Grand Cherokee.

Consumers get more from crossovers because they combine the functionality of the old truck-based SUVs with the ride and handling of a passenger car. Wolkonowicz says the shift from truck to car engineering probably saves 500 pounds in weight. The lower tonnage, along with improved aerodynamics that comes from sitting closer to the ground, will boost gas mileage.

Serious off-roaders, though, will want to stick with their Jeep Wranglers and Hummers, which will stay true to their rugged truck roots. Likewise, drivers who find themselves towing trailers will also want to keep their Chevy Tahoes and Suburbans, or Ford Expeditions, which will soldier on with their historic parts in place.

GM though, has found a way to have its cake and eat it, too. It has designed a hybrid gasoline-electric drive system for the Tahoe that gives the big SUV the same mileage as some passenger cars: 21 miles per gallon in the city, 22 mpg on the highway. The Tahoe hybrid is one of three finalists for the North American Truck of the Year award, voted by a jury of journalists.

"I'll be surprised if it doesn't win," says Wolkonowicz. "This is a way for people to get functionality and fun to drive in one package."

It all comes at a price. A two-wheel Tahoe hybrid costs $50,090, about $4,000 more than a comparably equipped conventional one, to pay for the electric powertrain and all those batteries. Progress in automobiles doesn't come cheap.

[Fallz]

IRS , Alex I hope your wrong as hell......lol.

I cant believe its going that way and getting further from its roots .

[AlexJet]

IRS , Alex I hope your wrong as hell......lol.

I cant believe its going that way and getting further from its roots .

That where all market going. :(

[shabaka]

i seriously dought any big changes for the 4runner
like a platform/segemnt change to x-over

the vehicle is, what it is and it does what it does very well
Big3 products made poor choices long ago in design and specs
with vehicles like Explorer, S/T-Blazer, Durango and that is why it will be no
surprise to see them go

Toyota does have Heritage, like Suburban/HUMMER
who here under 40 didn't grow-up with toyota meaning value, reliability, & features

the new Land-C is proof enough of where Toyota is heading in the "dieing"
SUV market....solid rear axle body on frame...same as before

the 120 platform is already designed way beyond anything the Domestics
have now, Unibody or frame

4runner has history and a solid place in the market ...i predict the next Gen will
be a step in the right direction, much like the current one :)

[AlexJet]

I hope it will stay as it is. I might be wronge. We'll have to wait.

[Yabedude]

Given they have the FJ again (offroad); the RAV4 has larger engines (V6) and more passenger room; the Highlander has the green engine; and the Sequoia space for the rich soccer Moms, I wouldn't be surprised if they discontinue the 4Runner. I see lots of new FJ's around, but hardly any new 4Runners. I know I would have bought the FJ if it was available in '03 and would buy it today due to the after market products available and the lack of readily available 4th gen 4Runner products.

[my034runner]

They would be stupid to discontinue the 4Runner. :iamwithst Like the LC, it has a lot of heritage, and has proven to be a solid vehicle. We sell a lot of 4Runners, more than FJC's. But we have a shortage on them right now.
Every six (6) years, Toyota has redesigned the 4Runner.
Look for a new 2009 model. :wavey:

[bulldog]

As of November 2007 Toyota still sells almost 2 4Runners for every FJC, so I doubt they will discontinue this midsize SUV.

As to the configuration, that will be a different problem. I still think their is a big makret for a mid size 4 dr true SUV, but it will most likely be lrger than the current one, and I just hope they still use an axle in the back vs IRS. Although the market demographic for the 4Runner might be more on road focussed and thus IRS. The FJC and LC will then have to fill the offroad duties in the line up, with the 4Runner and new Sequoia only suited for light duty offroad.

Guess time will tell.

[Cruiserhead]

i don't think it it will be such a sad end for the 4Runner!

Toyota has street AND trail SUV's in every market segment. There is no need to IRS the 4Runner b/c they already have the Highlander.

IMO, if they do any streamlining at all w/ truck based SUV's, it will be the demise of the Land Cruiser. The LX570 has taken over that market and LC sales are really low. It is a class-leader but also dings the overall manufacturer mpg scores.
I really think they would kill the lowest volume vehicles first rather than the 4Runner- which has a really strong brand name here.

[expat]

As of November 2007 Toyota still sells almost 2 4Runners for every FJC...

Wow. I did not realise that. :shocked: With the number of FJ's I see around I thought the market must have just about killed off the 4Runner. In the Thousand Oaks Toyota (my local dealer) there's only two 4R's on the lot, a lot more FJ's and in the parts department you would not know that the 4Runner exists.

There are displays of floor mats, key fobs, licence plates, pens, torches etc with almost all brands excenpt the 4Runner. Either they sell out real fast or maybe the 4R market just doesn't buy this stuff, or maybe they are holding off on any 4th gen stuff on the anticipation of the 5th gen..?

[my034runner]

Wow. I did not realise that. :shocked: With the number of FJ's I see around I thought the market must have just about killed off the 4Runner. In the Thousand Oaks Toyota (my local dealer) there's only two 4R's on the lot, a lot more FJ's and in the parts department you would not know that the 4Runner exists.

There are displays of floor mats, key fobs, licence plates, pens, torches etc with almost all brands except the 4Runner. Either they sell out real fast or maybe the 4R market just doesn't buy this stuff, or maybe they are holding off on any 4th gen stuff on the anticipation of the 5th gen..?


He's right. There's well over 100k 4Runners sold every year. I haven't checked this years yet, but 2:1 is about what we do, if not more.:D

[brad d]

the new Land-C is proof enough of where Toyota is heading in the "dieing" SUV market....solid rear axle body on frame...same as before


true... but before that it had solid axles front and rear.


Now the Icelanders will not use them LOL

http://www.4x4offroads.com/image-files/toyota-land-cruiser-picture-clean.jpg

[Yabedude]

If you like Iselandic rigs, check the pics out here: http://www.breytir.is/
http://www.breytir.is/video/jb.wmv

[shabaka]

true... but before that it had solid axles front and rear.


Now the Icelanders will not use them LOL

http://www.4x4offroads.com/image-files/toyota-land-cruiser-picture-clean.jpg

sweet :)
wish i could do that to my 4runner :) j/k

[bulldog]

OK guys lets stop dreaming and get back to topic :P

[AlexJet]

I've just received February issue of "Four Wheeler". On page 40it shows review of 2008 Sequoia. It has IRS instead of solid axle.

[my034runner]

I've just received February issue of "Four Wheeler". On page 40it shows review of 2008 Sequoia. It has IRS instead of solid axle.


Yes, we know. Knew that three months ago. It was done to facilitate the fold in the floor third row seats. To be able to drop the seats down into the floor, they needed to move the axle to IRS. That's at least one of the reasons given. :deadhorse

But, what does that have to do with the 4Runner. They're totally different platforms. :nono:

[AlexJet]

Yes, we know. Knew that three months ago. It was done to facilitate the fold in the floor third row seats. To be able to drop the seats down into the floor, they needed to move the axle to IRS. That's at least one of the reasons given. :deadhorse

But, what does that have to do with the 4Runner. They're totally different platforms. :nono:

I thought it's a bad sign of movement from solid axle to IRS.

[Cruiserhead]

I thought it's a bad sign of movement from solid axle to IRS.

I disagree. It is putting the Sequoia in-step with it's true use and IRS does free up more space for the fold-flat 3rd row. It is competition for the Expedition/Tahoe crowd. It looks like a really sweet package too.

In the Solid Rear Axle arena from bottom to top are: Tacoma-->FJCruiser-->4Runner-->GX470-->Land Cruiser--->LX570. There are probably over 30 configurations from below $20K all the way over $80K. Pretty comprehensive product offerings for 1 manufacturer. For every IRS, there is a SRA counterpart.

[my034runner]

I disagree. It is putting the Sequoia in-step with it's true use and IRS does free up more space for the fold-flat 3rd row. It is competition for the Expedition/Tahoe crowd. It looks like a really sweet package too.

In the Solid Rear Axle arena from bottom to top are: Tacoma-->FJCruiser-->4Runner-->GX470-->Land Cruiser--->LX570. There are probably over 30 configurations from below $20K all the way over $80K. Pretty comprehensive product offerings for 1 manufacturer. For every IRS, there is a SRA counterpart.



I, of course, :iagree James, you forgot the Tundra!! 10.5" R&P!!! :rockon:

[Cruiserhead]

oh yeah, the Tundra probably has over 30 configurations all by itself!

[my034runner]

oh yeah, the Tundra probably has over 30 configurations all by itself!



Like 33 or so!! :jester: :eek:

[JAM07Sport]

Given they have the FJ again (offroad); the RAV4 has larger engines (V6) and more passenger room; the Highlander has the green engine; and the Sequoia space for the rich soccer Moms, I wouldn't be surprised if they discontinue the 4Runner. I see lots of new FJ's around, but hardly any new 4Runners. I know I would have bought the FJ if it was available in '03 and would buy it today due to the after market products available and the lack of readily available 4th gen 4Runner products.

Fj cruiser is great until you grow up have kids and a wife. Try getting a infant car seat in a fj that was exactly the reason I did not get one I wanted one real bad. My brother inlaw had been talking about getting a fj for a year I had just got the 4r and told him think about the future your 26 if your going to have kids your next vehicle is most likley going to carry them around. He bought the fj anyway with a kid around the corner he is looking to get something with 4doors. That was a pretty expensive Fj to drive for 1yr.

The Fj is great for 2 people to go off roading in would be great as a second vehicle. But there are much better options for off the shelf offroad capible vehicles. Look at the Jeep Rubicon 2 people front and rear locker 33's from the factory. H3 33's rear locker from the factory 2 people uncomfrontably I drove one for a day also bad sight out of the vehicle. But hay you cant see out of a fj either.

[JAM07Sport]

Dont get me wrong I like a solid axel but what are the down sides of IRS besides you cant put 10 inches of lift on it. I ride ATVs alot and IRS is the standered now. The IRS ride over extreame terrian is great. With the anti sway bars disconected you can go places solid axel cant. With IRS you dont need alot of ground clearence. If they build it right and we do exactly what we are doing to the 4th gen. 3in of lift maby 1-1.5 body lift get some where in the 12-14in of ground clearence with 33's. It will be just as capible. The only problem I see is that the spring will have to be longer coils with lower spring rates to get lift which will cause the anti sway bars to be bigger to reduce body roll. But when disconnected Crawl ability will be greatly increased.Just my:2cents

[shabaka]

Dont get me wrong I like a solid axel but what are the down sides of IRS besides you cant put 10 inches of lift on it. I ride ATVs alot and IRS is the standered now. The IRS ride over extreame terrian is great. With the anti sway bars disconected you can go places solid axel cant. With IRS you dont need alot of ground clearence. If they build it right and we do exactly what we are doing to the 4th gen. 3in of lift maby 1-1.5 body lift get some where in the 12-14in of ground clearence with 33's. It will be just as capible. The only problem I see is that the spring will have to be longer coils with lower spring rates to get lift which will cause the anti sway bars to be bigger to reduce body roll. But when disconnected Crawl ability will be greatly increased.Just my:2cents

don't wanna turn this into Indy vs Solid debate...solid always wins :)
it has to do with
weight transfer, articulation, suspension travel...all of which solid has more/does better ...OFF ROAD

on road, full Indy all day long

on an ATV your C/G is pretty much dead center and low ...so softer spring rates and minimal pre-load can be used to keep very good articulation in Indy-Sus systems

like it was said the IFS/Solid-Rear/Frame layout fills a void that will exsist
for a very long time
so the 4runner most likely is not for IRS

(you know, manufacturers read these forums...:))

[JohnD]

good thread. the 4runner apparently will continue for 2009 and on, but rumor around the mill is it will graudally move away from its current bloodline, and evolve into a more street friendly SUV.. WTF!!

Tundra has 41 various models..


New sequoia platimun package is a friggn sweet ride, ..

[JAM07Sport]

(you know, manufacturers read these forums...:))

Yea but theres one small problem the amount of 4r used for their intended purpose is probly less than 1%. They would have no problem telling the people who want to use them go buy a FJ or a JEEP They wouldnt even notice it in the sales report. because for everyone of us there is a car and driver editor telling them you can sell thousands more with IRS.

Did a little research the HUMVEE has IRS besides for it being lke driving a tractor trailer through the woods. I think it has a pretty good offroad rep.
I think the common problem IFS and IRS has is they dont make the A-arms long enough. All the new class 1 buggys are fully independent.

I guess what I am trying to say is its going to happen just a matter of when.If we look for some ways to work with it,it may not be so bad.

[bulldog]

I just hope they keep the axle in the back for at least one more generation.

[brad d]

We will see.... I hope it is pretty much the same. But I think the main market wants a more car like SUV. I know toyota has a few like that, but the sales will tell them what to do.

If the 4runner is still hot seller, im sure they will keep it the same. How are the sales over the last few years?

[my034runner]

We will see.... I hope it is pretty much the same. But I think the main market wants a more car like SUV. I know Toyota has a few like that, but the sales will tell them what to do.

If the 4runner is still hot seller, I'm sure they will keep it the same. How are the sales over the last few years?



100k + per year :iagree

[shabaka]

Yea but theres one small problem the amount of 4r used for their intended purpose is probly less than 1%. They would have no problem telling the people who want to use them go buy a FJ ....I think the common problem IFS and IRS has is they dont make the A-arms long enough. All the new class 1 buggys are fully independent.

I guess what I am trying to say is its going to happen just a matter of when.If we look for some ways to work with it,it may not be so bad.

We will see.... I hope it is pretty much the same. But I think the main market wants a more car like SUV. I know toyota has a few like that, but the sales will tell them what to do.

If the 4runner is still hot seller, im sure they will keep it the same. How are the sales over the last few years?


both good points

[Teotwaki]

http://images.leftlanenews.com/content/september2007/toyota-4runner-1.jpg
and...
http://images.leftlanenews.com/content/september2007/toyota-4runner-2.jpg

and...
http://images.leftlanenews.com/content/september2007/toyota-4runner-ri.jpg

[AlexJet]

Hmm, camouflage is .....

[SofaRider]

That's an old spy shot of the new 'Cruiser.

[my034runner]

He's right Jim, that's an old picture of the '08 LC200 & LX 570! :deadhorse

[Teotwaki]

Sorry...... wuz only going from this article
http://www.leftlanenews.com/toyota-4runner-lexus-gx-future.html