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Unread 01-09-2017, 05:27 PM   #1
Trik444
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Default Need advice please!- In a wreck - Total Loss -

Last Friday a driver lost control of his vehicle trying to change lanes on the freeway and ran into the front fender/wheel and tire of my 4runner which caused me to get pinched between his Tundra and the cement barrier of the freeway. The damage was concentrated to my fenders, passenger door, snapped the coil-over (assuming damage to some other suspension components) and I had to limp it off the freeway. Somehow the front bumper, hood, engine and all engine components made it out unscathed and no leaks. Luckily, everyone was ok and the driver had insurance and I had a witness to back up what happened.

Fast forward to today and his insurance company, Progressive, called me and said it's going to be a total loss. Honestly I was bracing myself for this thinking they were going to try to lowball me on the value and overshoot the repair bill to try and total it out. Turns out I was right...however I'm absolutely surprised at the figures. My 2005 4runner Sport 4x4 has 190k on the clock and all of the upgrades mentioned in my signature line below. It has been the best and most reliable automobile I've ever owned and it probably had another 100k left in it as I took exceptional care of it.

Progressive is offering $7,200 and they are trying to claim over $8,500 in repair cost. The adjuster provided 7 local comps and none of them have 4WD or the benefits of having 4WD (rear locking diff, downhill assist control, etc.). Mileage is similar on all comps but he only gave a total of $585 for the aftermarket work - $130 for the wheels, $405 for the lift kit and $50 for full tint. No value was assigned for the 275/70/18 Nitto Terra Grapplers which were almost brand new (though he sure built the full retail cost of two tires into his repair estimate). No value was assigned for the aftermarket alarm or remote start.

I have done my own research and quickly found 3 comps on Autotrader between 14k-17k list price. I also have receipts for all aftermarket work and maintenance receipts to prove I kept the 4runner in incredible operating condition.

Can you suggest anything else I can provide the insurance adjuster or anything else I can argue to get them to provide a higher value? I don't believe $7,200 is what my 4runner is worth nor is it enough to replace my 4runner with something comparable. Am I being unreasonable in my expectations? The accident has been deemed 100% the fault of THEIR insured motorist. Thanks in advance for any feedback you can provide. I'll post pics later tonight.
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Totaled (RIP): 2005 Sport Edition 4x4
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Unread 01-09-2017, 05:44 PM   #2
Jeffy
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Sounds like BS to me... Have you had your own insurance company assess it? The fact that they didn't even add in 4WD to the value estimate is definitely wrong, that adds plenty of value.
You should have your insurance assess and see what they say. They'll give you their own repair estimate and also value estimate. If you're happy with what they say you can get a check from your company, and they will deal with the other insurance company, making it much easier for you. (I believe the technical term for this is "subrugation") This is what I did when I was in a fender bender a few months ago. I went straight to my own insurance, they did the assessment and took pictures for proof, and cut me a check within a few hours of me walking in the door. The fact that the other party already is proven at fault only makes this easier.


Side note: When I totalled my 4th gen, they let me keep it for a few weeks while I searched for and bought my 5th gen. Because of this, I was able to pull off and swap a lot of aftermarket things I had added. If you ask, they should allow you to do the same.
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Unread 01-09-2017, 05:48 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffy View Post
Sounds like BS to me... Have you had your own insurance company assess it? The fact that they didn't even add in 4WD to the value estimate is definitely wrong, that adds plenty of value.
You should have your insurance assess and see what they say. They'll give you their own repair estimate and also value estimate. If you're happy with what they say you can get a check from your company, and they will deal with the other insurance company, making it much easier for you. (I believe the technical term for this is "subrugation") This is what I did when I was in a fender bender a few months ago. I went straight to my own insurance, they did the assessment and took pictures for proof, and cut me a check within a few hours of me walking in the door. The fact that the other party already is proven at fault only makes this easier.


Jeffy thanks for the quick reply. I only have liability insurance on the 4Runner because it's not my daily...so my understanding is that my policy only covers accident repair for another driver if I am at fault in an accident.


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Totaled (RIP): 2005 Sport Edition 4x4
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Unread 01-09-2017, 05:53 PM   #4
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Here's a few photos from the accident. The front end of his Tundra peeled open like an orange. Honestly, just eyeballing the damage it doesn't seem like it's that bad... at least not $8500 worth of damage bad!


IMG_0540.JPGIMG_0544.JPGIMG_0545.JPGIMG_0546.JPGIMG_0537.JPGIMG_0539.JPG


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Current: 2017 TRD Off-Road Premium - Magnetic Grey: 295/70/17 Toyo Open Country MT's - Radflo 2.5 front coilovers and rear shocks - 17" SCS F5 wheels - Light Racing UCA's, Metal Tech adjustable rear lower arms - Body Mount Chop - Spidertrax

Totaled (RIP): 2005 Sport Edition 4x4
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Unread 01-09-2017, 05:53 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trik444 View Post
Jeffy thanks for the quick reply. I only have liability insurance on the 4Runner because it's not my daily...so my understanding is that my policy only covers accident repair for another driver if I am at fault in an accident.


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Ok. I'm by no means an expert so I'm not sure how that would affect anything. It might be worth calling your insurance and seeing what they say.
You are entitled by law to take your vehicle to any auto shop for an estimate. A Toyota dealer is probably a good choice as they're more likely to overestimate repair costs, but they will also try to talk down the value. Make sure they give you a quote on what they would sell the car for if it had no damage, NOT the trade-in value. If you can get a solid document stating that Toyota would sell the car for X amount of money (Let's just say 12,000 dollars), present that to the insurance company and demand they match it.
This is where you start sweet talking the sales reps and trying to get them to upsell the value for you
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Unread 01-09-2017, 05:54 PM   #6
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Do you have receipts for everything? I submitted all my receipts with my wreck but they still undervalue everything. That's an insurance company's job, to take your money and then do everything they can to not give any back. I ended up buying the wreck and parting it out and made my money back that way. But I also had full coverage on mine.

Yours looks mechanically sound, turn it into a trail rig maybe.
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Unread 01-09-2017, 05:55 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffy View Post
Ok. I'm by no means an expert so I'm not sure how that would affect anything. It might be worth calling your insurance and seeing what they say.
You are entitled by law to take your vehicle to any auto shop for an estimate. A Toyota dealer is probably a good choice as they're more likely to overestimate repair costs, but they will also try to talk down the value. Make sure they give you a quote on what they would sell the car for if it had no damage, NOT the trade-in value. If you can get a solid document stating that Toyota would sell the car for X amount of money (Let's just say 12,000 dollars), present that to the insurance company and demand they match it.
This is where you start sweet talking the sales reps and trying to get them to upsell the value for you


Great advice. Thank you!


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Current: 2017 TRD Off-Road Premium - Magnetic Grey: 295/70/17 Toyo Open Country MT's - Radflo 2.5 front coilovers and rear shocks - 17" SCS F5 wheels - Light Racing UCA's, Metal Tech adjustable rear lower arms - Body Mount Chop - Spidertrax

Totaled (RIP): 2005 Sport Edition 4x4
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Unread 01-09-2017, 05:59 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trik444 View Post
Here's a few photos from the accident. The front end of his Tundra peeled open like an orange. Honestly, just eyeballing the damage it doesn't seem like it's that bad... at least not $8500 worth of damage bad!





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That quote does seem a little excessive, but they go way overboard on insurance claims. They quoted me over 6k just for the front airbags and sensors, not including any body damage.
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Unread 01-09-2017, 06:00 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trik444 View Post
Great advice. Thank you!


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Happy to help! I hope it works out for you. Keep us updated.
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Unread 01-10-2017, 09:58 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikestang View Post
Do you have receipts for everything? I submitted all my receipts with my wreck but they still undervalue everything. That's an insurance company's job, to take your money and then do everything they can to not give any back. I ended up buying the wreck and parting it out and made my money back that way. But I also had full coverage on mine.

Yours looks mechanically sound, turn it into a trail rig maybe.
Yeah, I have all of the receipts plus I created a "maintenance log" spreadsheet this morning with an entire breakdown of upkeep including mileage/dates the work was performed (I'm a bit OCD with keeping paperwork on my cars). I'm going to compile everything later tonight along with the comps that I have found and send along a formal dispute. I also have a friend of mine who owns a body shop stopping by to have a look at the 4runner today to get his feedback. I guess we will see what happens.
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Totaled (RIP): 2005 Sport Edition 4x4
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Unread 01-10-2017, 10:28 AM   #11
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You dont have to take their offer, its that simple, they want to pay you as little as possible.

Save your receipts (you wont get much for aftermarket mods unfortunately) find your own comps, and sit down with the adjuster.

I wen through this on my 85 that got totaled. They offered me $800 the first time, we ended up around 3600-800 IIRC. Take your time, find comps, exact ones, same mileage, year, options etc. I like the idea of getting a value from the dealer. What does NADA say your value is?

Like i mentioned you wont get nearly anything for mods. They just dont really add value to the everyday public.

DO NOT TAKE ANY CHECK OR AGREE TO ANYTHING UNTIL YOUR HAPPY WITH THE VALUE! As soon as you cash a check its all done for.
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Unread 01-10-2017, 12:24 PM   #12
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Its hard to find a 4th gen 4wd under 200k miles for anything less than 12.


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Unread 01-10-2017, 01:20 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by java230 View Post
You dont have to take their offer, its that simple, they want to pay you as little as possible.

Save your receipts (you wont get much for aftermarket mods unfortunately) find your own comps, and sit down with the adjuster.

I wen through this on my 85 that got totaled. They offered me $800 the first time, we ended up around 3600-800 IIRC. Take your time, find comps, exact ones, same mileage, year, options etc. I like the idea of getting a value from the dealer. What does NADA say your value is?

Like i mentioned you wont get nearly anything for mods. They just dont really add value to the everyday public.

DO NOT TAKE ANY CHECK OR AGREE TO ANYTHING UNTIL YOUR HAPPY WITH THE VALUE! As soon as you cash a check its all done for.


Thank you very much. I'll take all of this into consideration!


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Totaled (RIP): 2005 Sport Edition 4x4
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Unread 01-10-2017, 01:22 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by T4RJon_SR5 View Post
Its hard to find a 4th gen 4wd under 200k miles for anything less than 12.


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That's what I'm finding as well. I have sourced 5 4WD Sport comps that all range between $15,995 - $16,995.


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Totaled (RIP): 2005 Sport Edition 4x4
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Unread 01-10-2017, 01:34 PM   #15
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my 03 V8 Limited isnt worth a damn thing anymore. Barely 9k on NADA and is around $5500-$7500 on KBB.

I wouldnt want it back, i'd move on and find something with my money. These arent worth what they used to be. The adjuster will refute your autotrader vehicles as "they're for sale, not sold...thats why" When the price is damn near double their offer. People can ask whatever they want to ask, doesnt mean it will sell. In the last 4 years the value on these have severely plummeted.
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Unread 01-10-2017, 05:18 PM   #16
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Trik444, that stinks. I hope you don't get ripped off.

LTDSC, I looked hard for weeks before finding my 4Runner and I still didn't get down to KBB prices. Two years ago 4th gens were selling like crazy at an asking price of $18-20k. If the bottom fell out of the market since then do you know why?
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Unread 01-10-2017, 09:25 PM   #17
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my 03 V8 Limited isnt worth a damn thing anymore. Barely 9k on NADA and is around $5500-$7500 on KBB.

I wouldnt want it back, i'd move on and find something with my money. These arent worth what they used to be. The adjuster will refute your autotrader vehicles as "they're for sale, not sold...thats why" When the price is damn near double their offer. People can ask whatever they want to ask, doesnt mean it will sell. In the last 4 years the value on these have severely plummeted.
LTDSC - I'm not looking to get the 4runner back at this point. I'm simply trying to argue the total loss value up as high as I can to drop into a new(ish) 4runner. The 7 comps the adjuster sent me to establish value were based on listed prices...not sold pricing. So I'm going to pass along my personal 5 listings that I have found between 14-16k asking price as well.
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Totaled (RIP): 2005 Sport Edition 4x4
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Unread 01-10-2017, 10:44 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trik444 View Post
LTDSC - I'm not looking to get the 4runner back at this point. I'm simply trying to argue the total loss value up as high as I can to drop into a new(ish) 4runner. The 7 comps the adjuster sent me to establish value were based on listed prices...not sold pricing. So I'm going to pass along my personal 5 listings that I have found between 14-16k asking price as well.
I normally don't try to steer people to other forums without good reason, so forgive me here.

I would post this on the T4R.org forum as well in the "General Section", there is a couple guys on the forum there who are/were in the insurance industry and would know your options better (I can't recall their usernames but they came in to chime in regards to some accident threads, theft thread, and a "off-road insurance" thread we had).
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Unread 01-11-2017, 09:13 AM   #19
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Thank you sir! I'll create a thread there too and see what pops up. The more information to consider the better.
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Totaled (RIP): 2005 Sport Edition 4x4
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Unread 01-11-2017, 06:48 PM   #20
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Seems like you could spend $1200 for new coilovers and get some fiberglass fenders for cheaper ...
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