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Unread 11-21-2014, 06:37 PM   #1
chiplee
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Default New CV's installed. Heavy vibration under hard accel

Just picked up the truck from the shop that installed rebuilt CV's and it's smooth as glass until you actually try to accelerate a little bit. Then the front drivetrain shakes like hell. I think it's safe to assume the shop didn't do anything wrong and one of the CV's is a bad rebuild, but does anyone have any suggestions on how to address the labor for the remove and replace? Bought them at Auto Zone. I can take it to them and show them what it's doing and explain I'm going to have to pay to have it swapped out, but what can they do about it? Probably nothing right?
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Unread 11-21-2014, 06:44 PM   #2
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It is normally a tricky thing if you buy parts from one and have the install done by another.

You may want to do a quick inspection and make sure everything looks OK from the installation. Hard to tell if it is a bad part or something not put back correctly. Just check to make sure it all is tight and nothing looks blatantly wrong.
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Unread 11-21-2014, 07:17 PM   #3
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Originally Posted by bulldog View Post
It is normally a tricky thing if you buy parts from one and have the install done by another.

You may want to do a quick inspection and make sure everything looks OK from the installation. Hard to tell if it is a bad part or something not put back correctly. Just check to make sure it all is tight and nothing looks blatantly wrong.
I called the autoparts store and they actually have a process for it. I have to bring them the part and both invoices (initial install and then the remove and replace) and they send everything back to the manufacturer for them to inspect it and consider helping with the labor. It'll be a while but at least there's a chance. This is a very good shop that's owned by a friend of mine, so I really doubt there's an issue with the install, but I'll look it over.
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Unread 11-22-2014, 03:03 PM   #4
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That's pretty good, but let's see what the part supplier does.
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Unread 11-22-2014, 05:55 PM   #5
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That's pretty good, but let's see what the part supplier does.
Yeah I'm not holding my breath. I'm going to have a few other possible culprits inspected and replaced if necessary before I have them pull the CV's back out. U-joints, motor mounts, etc...
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Unread 11-23-2014, 07:35 PM   #6
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I've never heard of unbalanced CVs. I'm sure they exist, but if you consider the physics of it, it would have to be very significant. The majority of what you will feel in terms of vibration comes from the outer ring of mass, the tire. The mass that is closer to center simply doesn't matter so much. The CV doesn't have a large diameter with which to create a noticeable vibration. I'd look a simple stuff first. Did they put your wheels on properly? Is it just on acceleration or does it do it at constant speed. An unbalanced situation should be a constant vibration, not just during acceleration. Certainly may not be noticeable until you get to higher speeds.
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Unread 11-23-2014, 08:03 PM   #7
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maybe the front diff need some fluid.
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Unread 11-24-2014, 06:41 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by KyleH View Post
I've never heard of unbalanced CVs. I'm sure they exist, but if you consider the physics of it, it would have to be very significant. The majority of what you will feel in terms of vibration comes from the outer ring of mass, the tire. The mass that is closer to center simply doesn't matter so much. The CV doesn't have a large diameter with which to create a noticeable vibration. I'd look a simple stuff first. Did they put your wheels on properly? Is it just on acceleration or does it do it at constant speed. An unbalanced situation should be a constant vibration, not just during acceleration. Certainly may not be noticeable until you get to higher speeds.
Thanks for the reply. I took it back to the shop today and had them drive it. Again, the owner is a friend of mine. On the initial install of the new CV's they found two missing and one loose diff mount bolt. We think their replacing the missing bolts and tightening the loose ones has just made it easier to feel the problem. The truck is smooth at part throttle cruise at any speed, but it shakes like hell under acceleration. Of note, today I noticed that if I'm turning left I don't have to be accelerating very hard at all to get it to shake. I'm starting to think wheel bearings, but I don't know.

Any thoughts on pulling the front drive shaft and driving it with the center diff locked to see if all vibration goes away? Just as a trouble shooting step. Plus it would allow me to see if the u-joints are binding or anything.
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Last edited by chiplee; 11-24-2014 at 07:02 PM.
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Unread 11-24-2014, 06:44 PM   #9
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maybe the front diff need some fluid.
Thanks, but I don't think so. The guys did a full inspection and service for me. Found the rear diff low but the front was fine.

On that note, separate problem (I assume)... Fluid has started to flow up the ARB air line from my rear diff and drip out at the compressor. My compressor wiring is all unhooked at the moment. Need to rewire it and see if compressing the line can stop the diff fluid from coming up the air line. They cleared some drain line in the diff for me that they thought might be causing it to build pressure, but it's still doing it. Luckily my new car arrives in two weeks so I can get this thing on blocks and give it some TLC.
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Unread 11-24-2014, 07:00 PM   #10
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I should add that I had started to feel this vibration before the new CV's went in, but it wasn't as bad. If it was just a brand new vibration that only began after the new CV's went in, then I would be happy to blame one of the CV's or the shop. In my situation, once I thought about it I realized it was doing the same thing before, but it was less pronounced, and it was mostly only under acceleration from high speed to higher speed and over hills and such. Again, I think the loose front diff was masking the problem, and now that everything is tight it's presenting in a much more obvious way.
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Unread 11-24-2014, 07:36 PM   #11
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Bizarre. Sounds like the vibration occurs when under power/torque. I'd just be guessing from here. Look for bent stuff. I'm also wondering if a bad diff could cause such issues. You could probably pull your front drive shaft, and i assume this would get rid of the issue, as it would no longer be sourcing torque to the front drive axle. Not sure this would get you any closer to your answer, however.
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Unread 11-24-2014, 07:55 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KyleH View Post
Bizarre. Sounds like the vibration occurs when under power/torque. I'd just be guessing from here. Look for bent stuff. I'm also wondering if a bad diff could cause such issues. You could probably pull your front drive shaft, and i assume this would get rid of the issue, as it would no longer be sourcing torque to the front drive axle. Not sure this would get you any closer to your answer, however.
It is definitely tq/load related. If the drivetrain isn't loaded up it doesn't do it. I speculated about the front diff since it had come loose (I think it was actually left loose by the shop that installed it, but that's another story), and the shop doing the CV work said they didn't think so. They said it would whine under accel or vibrate at all times if it was diff related. The diffs were were built by Chase at ECGS, so I know they're done right. If it turns out to be the diff it would be a matter of loose mounts causing the failure. What about that CV extension thing on the passenger side? I've never really dug into the front drivetrain parts that much. Could that fail?
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Unread 11-24-2014, 08:00 PM   #13
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Broken diff mount?
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Unread 11-24-2014, 08:20 PM   #14
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Broken diff mount?
Gosh I hope not. It's Kurt's reinforced diff mount and it was just looked over by a reputable shop. I'll look though.
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Unread 11-24-2014, 11:05 PM   #15
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It may be worth it to pull the front driveshaft, lock the center diff and see what it does. Will help to isolate other elements than the front drive line.

Before you do, go to big parking lot, do full lock turns to both side while accelerating (no need to go full throttle), bit it will help to load up the outer CV's and see how they behave. Open you windows and listen for clunking noises when doing so.

When checking the diff brackets, also check the rear mount by the driveshaft, to see if it is in good shape and tight. I think the most likely causes have been covered, loose front diff/mount going bad or bad CV. Also good time to check the front drive shaft bolts if they are tight.
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Unread 11-25-2014, 05:02 AM   #16
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Have you tried lifting the front end off the ground and spinning the wheels by hand? You may notice binding with this method. If you do, I would get a floor jack to place under the control arm and raise the assembly up until the wheel free spins. If this happens you know that a joint in the axle is binding up.
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Unread 11-25-2014, 07:41 AM   #17
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Have you tried lifting the front end off the ground and spinning the wheels by hand? You may notice binding with this method. If you do, I would get a floor jack to raise the assembly up until the wheel free spins. If this happens you know that a joint in the axle is binding up.
No we/I haven't. Sounds like a good idea though. I'll do it as soon as I can. I think there will be binding on the left at anything close to full droop, and when steering left. I might be over-thinking the whole thing. New CV's went in, vibration got a lot worse. It's probably bad rebuilds on the CV's.
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Unread 11-25-2014, 07:45 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bulldog View Post
It may be worth it to pull the front driveshaft, lock the center diff and see what it does. Will help to isolate other elements than the front drive line.

Before you do, go to big parking lot, do full lock turns to both side while accelerating (no need to go full throttle), bit it will help to load up the outer CV's and see how they behave. Open you windows and listen for clunking noises when doing so.

When checking the diff brackets, also check the rear mount by the driveshaft, to see if it is in good shape and tight. I think the most likely causes have been covered, loose front diff/mount going bad or bad CV. Also good time to check the front drive shaft bolts if they are tight.
Sounds like a plan. I'll do Mike07SE's plan first, since it's easiest, and then move on to pulling the front drive shaft to do some testing with the center diff locked.
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Unread 11-26-2014, 06:40 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chiplee View Post
No we/I haven't. Sounds like a good idea though. I'll do it as soon as I can. I think there will be binding on the left at anything close to full droop, and when steering left. I might be over-thinking the whole thing. New CV's went in, vibration got a lot worse. It's probably bad rebuilds on the CV's.
It can happen. Almost two years ago I got a set of Radflo's to upgrade the suspension. Long story short, the shocks were too long creating a bind at full droop on the LHS (Driver's) side. I thought the CV's went bad and replaced with Autozone Duralast rebuilds. This made things worse as both sides would now bind creating a nearly undriveable truck. When I took them out to put rebuilt OEM's back in I compared the inner joints and found that the casting was a similar form but completely different dimension than the stocks were.

The end solution was that I kept the extra "long travel" shocks, took the OEM inner joints to a machine ship and had them mill it down 1/2", rebuilt, reinstalled. Truck runs great now with no problems.
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Unread 11-26-2014, 07:44 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike07SE View Post
It can happen. Almost two years ago I got a set of Radflo's to upgrade the suspension. Long story short, the shocks were too long creating a bind at full droop on the LHS (Driver's) side. I thought the CV's went bad and replaced with Autozone Duralast rebuilds. This made things worse as both sides would now bind creating a nearly undriveable truck. When I took them out to put rebuilt OEM's back in I compared the inner joints and found that the casting was a similar form but completely different dimension than the stocks were.

The end solution was that I kept the extra "long travel" shocks, took the OEM inner joints to a machine ship and had them mill it down 1/2", rebuilt, reinstalled. Truck runs great now with no problems.
Yeah, so I'm basically leaning toward sending my toyota CV's off to CVO (constant velocity of Ocala) for a performance build. I'll use these crap Auto Zone shafts for DD purposes until those get back and then return them and ask for help with the R&R cost.
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