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Unread 05-15-2013, 03:32 PM   #1
Riflman
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Default Limited Slip Rear Diff? ARB up front or replace back.

In the 4wheeler Magazine build, they used a 2004, and installed a rear ARB. They did nothing to the gears. I'm curious as to why they didn't put the ARB up in the front, unless the 2004 models didn't have a limited slip rear diff? I have a 2005 with KDSS and I *think* I have a LSD in the rear, but maybe not? I agree it's not a locker, but it seems to me that if it does have LSD in the rear, and the Trail Lex truck had LSD in the rear, that an ARB up front would be the best option. This would also avoid the all to common problem when climbing over rocks or up hills, where the front end lifts off the ground, one of the front wheels spins and when the truck comes down it breaks the axle or grenades the diff. Am I totally off base here?

Last edited by Riflman; 05-15-2013 at 09:20 PM.
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Unread 05-15-2013, 05:45 PM   #2
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Locking rear >> LSD

You wouldn't want to lock the front without locking the rear. Rear is much more influential in its power delivery.

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Unread 05-15-2013, 08:57 PM   #3
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Plenty of people run rovers with CDL and a locker in the front only. The locker actually works better up front if you don't have anything in the rear. I had dual TT's in mine, and would not run a TT in the front alone, but if running a true locker like the ARB is, having it in the front makes a lot of sense if you can only afford one.
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Unread 05-15-2013, 09:23 PM   #4
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Unfortunately, I just discovered the Torsen T-3 is in the GX470, but it is merely a Limted Slip CENTER Diff. There is no LSD in the rear. The Center Diff is not a true locking diff like the rover, which means it's severely handicapped without a locker in one of the axles. Good grief. I might have jumped the gun buying one of these things. The information on the trucks is very misleading.
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Unread 05-16-2013, 12:05 AM   #5
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The GX has a limited slip in the middle, but you can also lock the center diff. The front and rear axles only has electronic traction control (ATRAC) to apply the brake to a spinning wheel.

Typically people just slap an ARB in the rear and use ATRAC for the front, this works pretty well.
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Unread 05-16-2013, 10:19 AM   #6
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Hey Bulldog. That's good to know. So if the switch locks it, you get 50/50 power front back, and could run with one drive shaft in an emergency? If so, then that is much better. I was concerned there for a bit. If I understand correctly from reading other posts, you have a ARB in the front correct? Do you also have one in the back? If so, do you usually only use the rear?

Also, did you regear? I understand you are also running 35's, so do you mind if I ask how high your lift is, and what wheels and offset you are running? I see you have a body lift as well, but I'm not sure if that's available for the GX. Sounds like it would be a good idea. That way I don't have to do the bumpers right away and still get the tires I want right away. Did you do extended brake lines?
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Unread 05-16-2013, 11:37 AM   #7
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Don't stress. Lock up the center and use ATRAC and you will go anywhere you are willing to go with this truck. I just ran a to of trails in MOAB with no issue at all with no lockers.
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Unread 05-16-2013, 02:29 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Riflman View Post
Hey Bulldog. That's good to know. So if the switch locks it, you get 50/50 power front back, and could run with one drive shaft in an emergency? If so, then that is much better. I was concerned there for a bit. If I understand correctly from reading other posts, you have a ARB in the front correct? Do you also have one in the back? If so, do you usually only use the rear?

Also, did you regear? I understand you are also running 35's, so do you mind if I ask how high your lift is, and what wheels and offset you are running? I see you have a body lift as well, but I'm not sure if that's available for the GX. Sounds like it would be a good idea. That way I don't have to do the bumpers right away and still get the tires I want right away. Did you do extended brake lines?
Yes if you lock the center diff it is 50/50 front/back, and you can run without a driveshaft in an emergency (we have don eso in the past).

I use ARB rear and front. I mostly use rear 90% of when I need to use lockers, and lock both axles only 10% of the time (estimated). Mostly lock both for rock climbs and very technical sections.

I used 4.56 gears, but my truck is heavy and lately I think 4.88s may have been a better choice for my use. Highway gas mileage sucks anyway, so 4.88s may be good if you plan a heavy build. I also run have Toyo MT 35s on 16x8, 4.5 BS (315/75/16).

See my thread on fitting 35s on a 4Runner for some ideas.
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Unread 05-16-2013, 02:58 PM   #9
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Okay. Thanks. I'll look for the thread. My understanding is that 16's won't clear the brakes on the GX, or I would go that route. Many MANY more options for tires and more affordable too. The 18" BFG are ridiculous compared to equivalent sizes in 16".

I ran 34" SSR and 4.16's on my Rover, and that was about right. Before that my tranny was hunting constantly. Back in the 4wheeler article days, gears weren't available for the GX, but I'm guessing they are now. Gears were huge $$$$ for the disco's. If I recall, rings and pinions a few years ago were about $1200 per set. Not sure how expensive they are for the GX/toyota platform. Maybe much less. And I did some reading on the lockers on the front with IFS. Seems that is the weak link, otherwise I would lock that first. It's not a disco with SAS though, so I understand now why the rear is the way to go if only doing one.
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Unread 05-16-2013, 04:50 PM   #10
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I think you may be over thinking things due to your Rover experience. The GX is a Toyota. It will serve you better than you think. You should protect the body and go wheel it. It will surprise you. I have had mine all over the place and it never let me down. No need to regear, lock, etc. Just enjoy it!
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Unread 05-16-2013, 06:25 PM   #11
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Thanks Dan. I think once I get the lift and tires on it in a week or so, I'll feel much better. I feel like I'm driving a mini van right now. The last time I drive a toyota was the sr5 quarter ton I had back in the mid 80's and the 4x4 pickup I had early 90's. Been a long time. Since then I've had a lifted fullsize Ford and Chevy pickups for the farm and for hauling stuff like bales and ATVs, and Land Rovers for playing and for my DDs. Towed with both. My Rover had trailer breaks and towed a 7500 pound trailer.

One thing I was surprised about with this GX was the mileage. Computer shows 9.6 or so driving around town, and 11.5 or so on the freeways. I just did it manually after strait up 170 miles of highway and got 14. I only got around 11-12 in my Rover, but I had 34" tires and about 1500 pounds of armor on it, lockers, rack, roof tent, etc. Once I get the tires and armor on the GX, I think I'll be in the single digits. God knows what happens when I load it up with stuff on the roof. I'm thinking I need new plugs and wires. It's super clean in the motor bay, had the timing belt and water pump done a few months ago, and the alternator done right before I bought it, new rad last December, but I can't find anything in the service notes about plugs and wires, so they are likely the original ones with 100,000 miles on them. Gonna start there, and maybe get it tuned and injectors cleaned. I didn't buy it for fuel economy, but I really expected it to be better than my Rovers.
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Unread 05-16-2013, 06:29 PM   #12
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I got 14 as built out to Moab and back. I am getting better now that I replaced my hosed up front calipers.

have patience...Toyotas will take care of you
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Unread 05-16-2013, 06:30 PM   #13
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open open...walked it and worse without a single chirp (I ran this whole trail with the center diff unlocked).

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Unread 05-16-2013, 06:50 PM   #14
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The lexus service history shows breaks were done December 11th, but it doesn't say what was done. Could just be pads. I'll bring it in and have the brakes checked all around. The calipers could indeed be a problem, but if so, I don't here, see or smell anything out of the ordinary, or notice any drag when coasting. There's a listing for front susp/drive axle on the same date with 99853 miles, but no details on that either. The passenger front shock is wet, so I suspect it's done. I might drive over to Lexus of Cerritos and see if I can pull service records for the car, since pretty much everything was done there. Would be nice to know where it's at. It's incredibly clean inside, outside and under for a truck with 100,000 miles (160,000km!!). I'm a transplanted Canuck and we normally consider a truck as on its death bed at 100,000 miles. We have very harsh winters and a ton of salt though, and it's incredible how much that shortens the life of vehicles compared to Cali.

I have ti admit I'm sure anxious to get this thing off the streets of LA and into some rocks, sand, mud and snow.
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Unread 05-16-2013, 06:52 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dankunz View Post
open open...walked it and worse without a single chirp (I ran this whole trail with the center diff unlocked).

Wow, not even the center diff locked? Just to see if you could do it? Your truck is looking good Dan. Surprised you're still on stock wheels with all the other goodies you have on there. What size tires? Gonna go find your build thread now so I don't keep asking redundant questions.
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Unread 05-16-2013, 06:59 PM   #16
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They are 285/75R17s.

You don't have to change wheels to wheel. I did change the UCAs.

These will walk all over where a Rover can go stock with just a little work. ATRAC is a game changer.
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Unread 05-16-2013, 07:19 PM   #17
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What is ATRAC?? If it is TC uses the brakes to stop wheel spin and apply power to the wheel with grip, then the Disco II's had that stock. it worked great with CDL and T's, but it could be hard on the brakes and ABLS, so you have the ability to turn that function off. If you have CDL engaged, and then turn off the truck and restart it, the ABS and TC lights will come on to indicate it is disabled. You then wheel as normal with CDL locked. To get it back on, you disengage CDL, and turn the truck off and on again. Voila.

I've talked on Facebook with one guy who was running 305/60R18 BFG KM2's on Monster XD 18x9" wheels with -12 offset and he had zero rubbing. That's a 32.5" x 12.5" tire. I'm guessing the factory tire with the wider tire makes it rub and require UCAs? I never did Radius arms or anything on my Disco, but I did rub a bit with my big 34" SSR, but only one side under full lock, so I didn't worry about it. No major cupping of tires after alignment. I'm guessing the IFS might be more problematic? If I do the wheels, and they don't rub, are UCA's still important?

Lastly, I noticed your Ironman shocks are only listed 45mm lift, or about 1.8". Does that sound like what you got? I'd like a bit more if possible.
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Unread 05-16-2013, 08:11 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Riflman View Post
What is ATRAC??
www.toyota120.com/forum/showthread.php?t=25

http://www.toyota120.com/forum/searc...earchid=493882
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Unread 05-17-2013, 06:10 AM   #19
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My tire measures 33.9" new and rubs on full lock (non-destructive rub).

I did do the UCAs (as I said) and I have a little rub on the UCAs and body mounts at full lock...very minimal.

The lift I have is perfect for what I do right now and the tire I am running, it looks "just right" and performs well. I am going to add more in the coming years because I plan on fitting 35" tires, but have more mods to make that work (including some cutting).

Again, I think you will find comparing to a Rover won't work. My truck can go most anywhere it "should" be able to go. Obviously pushing into harder terrain is not a good idea unless you are built for it. The sand, slickrock, etc should be a non-issue for you.

I think you need to get some basic armor and go wheel to understand.
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