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Unread 03-18-2013, 03:44 PM   #1
jediwebdude
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Default to re-gear or not re-gear - that is the question

The more I off-road, the more I realize I need to make improvements. I am about to order an ARB rear locker with mini compressor. Still debating if I want a front locker.

While thinking about both lockers, started considering re-gearing to 4.56. I have the V8 and am currently running 275/70 17 BFG T/A KO, which is a 55 lb tire at 32-inches. I have determined these tires are great for road and non-technical off-road use, but for rock crawling, they are too soft (entire chunks of tread are missing), and too small. I want to go up to 285/70 17 (or 18 if I find 18" off-road rims with rock rings, where the rim would actually fit over the SE brake calipers).

That tire size in a beefier tire would take me to about a 60 lb tire at 33-inches.

Not sure how much the truck weighs now, but have added Demello front bumper with winch, CBI rear bumper with swing-out tire carrier, and will soon be installing a Perkins rack.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
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2007 4Runner SE 4WD V8 | BFG A/T KO2 285/70 17 | Radflo 2.5 w/ 3" lift | All-Pro 3.5" rear springs | 4x4 Labs rear bumper | BaerTrax rock sliders | Demello front bumper | ComeUp 9.5 winch | FN rims | RCI alum full set of skids | Gobi Roof Rack

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Unread 03-18-2013, 04:14 PM   #2
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Subd.
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2003 SR5 4WD V8: TRD SUPERCHARGED, TRD Headers, ARB Bull Bar, CBI Rear, OME 886 coils w/ 1/4'' Spacer, SuperFlex's, 5100's, 285 Cooper STT, Slee SS Brake Lines, Custom Sway Bar Links, 4xInnovations Sliders, AllPro Lower Links, DDM HID'sCustom Y-Pipe, Magnaflow, BudBuilt, KurtFab Diff-Brace, Wet Okole's, JL Sub/Amp
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Unread 03-18-2013, 05:27 PM   #3
daPitbull
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If you do it, check out East Coast Gear Supply. They'll send you built 3rds you can swap yourself.
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Unread 03-18-2013, 08:39 PM   #4
Robinhood4x4
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Stock tires were about 31" so the difference in diameter between stock and 33s is about 6%. That's how much you'll need to make up in gearing to effectively return it to stock. What's the stock gear ratio and what's the difference between stock and 4.56?

Usually, 6% is really noticeable with the older trucks like my 93 with the 3.0 or 4 cyl 2.4, but I'd bet with your V8, it's liveable. Mostly, the reason to regear is so it's more pleasant on the road and although lower gears do help on the rocks, it's not that noticeable.

My recommendation is to not regear.

However, this is coming from somebody who is used to having absolutely no power with the 93 and thinks the 07 V6 is a rocket ship. I'm not too concerned with lack of power so I could live with the stock gears. If you can't, then regear.

As for an ARB in the front, the answer is simple. If you're going to regear, then put a locker in the front because you're already going to pay somebody to tear it apart anyway. If you're not going to regear, then you have time to decide whether you need a locker in the front or not.

Ideally, you should just wait until you buy the tires before deciding whether you need to regear.
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Unread 03-18-2013, 11:24 PM   #5
bulldog
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I have an 03 V8, with bumpers, 35 Toyo MTs, yada yada, and it weighs in at a LOT. I fitted 4.56s and ARB lockers front and back. MOst of the time it is great, but going up in steep mountain climbs and loaded with stuff on the roof, I would prefer 4.88s. Offroad in 4LO the 4.56s are great and plenty though.

If you only plan on 33s the 4.56s will be fine with the V8. Also the 07 V8 has more oomph than the 03/04s, so going up in mountains it will be fine (especially since yours will likely never be as heavy as my piggy).

I would highly suggest you get a front locker while you go through this, do it well once and be done. Although the front locker will only be handy in rock trails and sometimes very tricky situations on other trails. However since you do a regear you may as well get a locker set up, as labor adds up, especially on the front.

However before doing anything, put on the 33s and see how it feels to you. Go out more and see how it feels offroad, the ATRAC is pretty capable and the V8 has good grunt. Lockers and gears are big bucks and you want to make sure you actually need it before laying it out. Plenty of guys run stock gears with 33s, and also offroad without lockers. However if you do decide to do it, do it once and do it properly.

BTW good call on the ECGS from Pitt. Can save you some time and $$$ if you can replace the diffs yourself and hook up the compressor and wiring.
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Unread 03-19-2013, 08:09 AM   #6
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Thanks guys. I first got into off-roading in Jan 2012. Since then, I've been off-roading 14 times at 6 off-road parks throughout Texas, Oklahoma, and Missouri. The ATRAC has treated me well. I didn't get stuck until this past weekend...got stuck twice (see photo below). In both situations, at least a rear locker would've helped, as well as bigger tires. The re-gearing would be nice, as well as the front locker.

The more I think about this, the more I'm leaning toward just a rear locker and 33-inch tires. Rock crawling is fun, but I have pushed my 4R too far several times and have sustained body damage (usually because some Jeep guys at a difficult route will say "your truck can't do that"...challenge accepted). My end goal for my 4R was to have an expedition vehicle, not a rock crawler. So maybe I need to take the $3K to $4K I would spend on regearing/front locker/install labor and just buy an old beater Toyota and turn it into my rock crawler. You guys have given me some things to think about.


Extraction by VisualUniverse, on Flickr
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Unread 03-19-2013, 10:23 AM   #7
the_josh
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jediwebdude View Post


Extraction by VisualUniverse, on Flickr
DUDE!!! you got got assisted by the man, MARLIN!!!


way cool dude by the way as im sure you know


pricing varies depending on where you are located but for me it was $1400 to Regear 4.88's, ARB locker and all labor per axle so $2800 total. i didn't want to pay labor twice so i went ahead and did it all. and like bulldog said if you decide to go that route do it right the first time
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Unread 03-19-2013, 10:32 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by the_josh View Post
DUDE!!! you got got assisted by the man, MARLIN!!!

way cool dude by the way as im sure you know

pricing varies depending on where you are located but for me it was $1400 to Regear 4.88's, ARB locker and all labor per axle so $2800 total. i didn't want to pay labor twice so i went ahead and did it all. and like bulldog said if you decide to go that route do it right the first time
Funny story. I met him the day before and told him I wanted to get a photo of him with his rig. I could tell right away he was like an icon among all the Land Cruiser guys. Next day I go out on a trail I had conquered the day before. Only this time, I went by myself...yes, I was being over-confident. Sure enough, I got stuck. Attempted self-rescue by winching to the only tree in the area. It was leafless...shoulda been my first clue. I brought down the tree. So I start looking around and to my delight, I see the Marlin red Taco going by. I flagged him down. His first words were, "I would love to help you." How many off-roaders greet you with such kind words?

After he extracted me, I went a little further and got stuck again (photo is of this 2nd time to get stuck). He pulled me out again. I got some great shots of him crawling in his Taco. We had some great conversation, so in the end, I considered it a blessing that I got stuck as I got to know Marlin better.
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Unread 03-19-2013, 12:39 PM   #9
Robinhood4x4
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You've got a good, all around off roading platform built up and a rear locker would be icing on the cake.

As for a dedicated rock crawler, it's cheaper to buy one that's already built up and fix whatever the PO did to screw it up. On my friends truck, we had to fix the half assed job they did on the wiring (they used wire nuts for gods sake!), bleed the brakes, fix a hub, etc, but he got a fully ready, V8 swapped, dual locked, dual tcase, solid axled, 38" tire'd monster that could tackle just about any trail. All this for about $5000.

I have $5000 just in parts, travel expenses, and food for my friends, to do the SAS on my truck and it's nowhere near as capable as my friends truck. Of course, mine handles much better on the street and is daily drivable. His, not so much.

On the flip side, building yours from scratch, teaches you about your truck and how to fix it on the trail.
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Unread 03-19-2013, 02:32 PM   #10
jediwebdude
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robinhood4x4 View Post
You've got a good, all around off roading platform built up and a rear locker would be icing on the cake.

As for a dedicated rock crawler, it's cheaper to buy one that's already built up and fix whatever the PO did to screw it up. On my friends truck, we had to fix the half assed job they did on the wiring (they used wire nuts for gods sake!), bleed the brakes, fix a hub, etc, but he got a fully ready, V8 swapped, dual locked, dual tcase, solid axled, 38" tire'd monster that could tackle just about any trail. All this for about $5000.

I have $5000 just in parts, travel expenses, and food for my friends, to do the SAS on my truck and it's nowhere near as capable as my friends truck. Of course, mine handles much better on the street and is daily drivable. His, not so much.

On the flip side, building yours from scratch, teaches you about your truck and how to fix it on the trail.
Exactly what I'm thinking. I started looking to see what under $5K could buy me in classic Toyota rigs. Seems if it's a Land Cruiser, the prices are higher than $5K, but old 4Runners and Tacos are far more affordable. A 1st gen 4Runner with removable top appeals to me. Would prefer the 6-cyl over the 4-cyl. There's a 1st gen with the 4-cyl in great running condition avail for $2,500 near me.
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Unread 03-20-2013, 12:12 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by daPitbull View Post
If you do it, check out East Coast Gear Supply. They'll send you built 3rds you can swap yourself.
Went to their website. Not sure I'm looking at the right thing. Am I looking for Toyota 8" parts?
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Unread 03-20-2013, 08:59 PM   #12
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8" clamshell front
8" v6/turbo rear
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. . . . . . . . . . . .. .. .. . Yukon 4.88, ARB locker, Truetrac LSD, Camburg UCA, Custom Rear LCA, Energy Suspension
.... .. .... ... ..... ... .. ...Braille dual battery, Bulldog ALPHA 9300, Viking 3/8 rope, Gunnebo hook, BajaRack, Slimlites

.... .. .... ... ..... ... .. ...build & gallery
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Unread 03-20-2013, 09:09 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by shabaka View Post
8" clamshell front
8" v6/turbo rear
Thanks
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